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[01.040.009][Model] Small ship blast doors cannot sit flush with other blocks

Discussion in 'Bug Reports' started by jtgibson, Jul 25, 2014.

Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. jtgibson Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    71
    So I finally found out why all of my (small) ships were self-destructing when I tried to make flush ramps with them, and that's because the blast doors, unlike the large ship blast doors, have very strange collision meshes that do not recede a few centimetres from their edges.

    Where large ship blast doors can and do close seamlessly and otherwise work well together due to the slight recession in the shape of their collision meshes, small ship blast doors are not recessed and therefore will collide with vertices and edges of nearby blocks instead of passing them seamlessly.

    To reproduce:
    1) Create any small ship blast door using all of the four block types.
    2) Use Alt+Shift+F12 to observe the collision meshes.
    3) Small ship models will have observable collision meshes.
    4) A large ship blast door will have no visible collision meshes at the edges of the doors, as the collision meshes are slightly away from the edges. A small ship blast door, however, will have several observable meshes. The worst offender is the corner blocks, which have small prisms on the corners of the block that actually exceed the ordinary block bounds!

    Large ship blast doors have visible recession on the sides, allowing them to be seamlessly built and even interlock:
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/58871752/Misc/SpaceEngineers_2014-07-24-23-55-35-152_FinalScreen.png
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/58871752/Misc/SpaceEngineers_2014-07-24-23-57-52-474_FinalScreen.png

    Small ship blocks' collision meshes do not recess, however, and prevent placement of objects nearby:
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/58871752/Misc/SpaceEngineers_2014-07-25-00-02-22-376_FinalScreen.png
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/58871752/Misc/SpaceEngineers_2014-07-25-00-03-14-153_FinalScreen.png

    Log: Not required.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Phand Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,650
    Hi,

    we know about this and it is intentional. I will ask guys whether we will change it or not. It also largely depends on feedback from players. Thank you for report though.
     
  3. Mau Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    27
    I noticed smal ships blast doors not able to fit tight with other objects too. If this is intentional, what's the point of this?
     
  4. Wolf Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    162
    What's the point of having blast doors.
    When it is half a block from blast door and the frame around?
    And adjustment thingy on Rotor makes the no difference.
     
  5. jtgibson Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    71
    Chalk me up to the "feedback from players" category -- it is inconsistent to have large ship blast doors seamless with other blocks but small ship blast doors not seamless; it makes small ship blast doors useful as little more than decoration, since they cannot actually be used as "blast doors" that fit into a hole in the hull, only as "hatch covers" that close down over a hole. We (I) want airstairs! =)

    The only legitimate technical reason for the distinction is the potential that the doors might jitter around enough (due to unstable physics simulation) to cause damage to the object while it is in flight -- but in principle that is something that can be worked around through clever use of existing features (e.g., landing gear "pads" to protect the hull and lock the door in place, etc.).
     
  6. Xandalis Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    45
    I'd definitely like to see the small blast door collision meshes reduced to be in-line with their large counterparts.
     
  7. JayCo2013 Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    356
    So its intentional that small ship blast door meshes are not allowing small ship blast doors to slide past other blocks, Please tell us what the purpose of small ship blast door blocks is then...???????
    What are we supposed to build with them since we all are trying to build doors with them and they are not working for that purpose and you say its intentional????
     
  8. Phand Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,650
    Nice question marks. I would love to tell you that but I DO NOT KNOW. I said I will ask guys. I also said that it could be changed according to feedback. Shouting is actually not helping at all.
     
  9. Kristian Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    4
    Dear devs. Small ships need reliable blastdoor support, so we can make proper doors and ramps for our crafts. Regards: Everyony (Everyone in my own tiny head at least)
    Its no big dealbreaker, but would be nice to see it "fixed" next thursday, so we can make proper military transport crafts with neat rear ramps ;)
     
  10. Styrkr Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    177
    Add my vote to have small ship blast doors act like the ones for large ships. Not having them act the same is entirely pointless. They are currently just like other blocks but look different.


    @Phand

    Who's shouting? He is only asking you to do your job. If you're going to do PR, it is your responsibility to answer questions like that. If you don't know the answer, it is your job to get it from someone who does. Also, sarcasm is a poor trait to express as a PR coordinator.
     
  11. Floki Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    247
    My suggestion is to either make them act like their large counterpart or change the name. Having them inconsistent with their large counterpart is both confusing and a strange design choice in my opinion.
     
  12. Floki Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    247
    eh, leave her be, put yourself in her shoes and imagine just how many people must give her crap, despite the fact she literally just said she'd check it out.
     
  13. Phand Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,650
    I am not doing PR. I am working on bug forum, because I am tester my job is testing actually. And I am visiting bug section for feedback and inspiration as what to test. Of course I want to help people but it is not my responsibility to do all forum stuff at all. It is just my pure willingness. So do not assume things when you do not have enough information about how things truly are. Thanks.
     
  14. JayCo2013 Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    356
    First off I would like to appologise to Phand for assuming that they were a developer, But having Developer under your name instead of perhaps Tester kinda confuses me.

    Secondly you replied saying that the small ship blastdoor blocks didn't work intentionally, I was simply asking you to tell us why they were made not to work on purpose which is what the word intentionally means !

    Here is your line.....
    **********
    Hi,

    we know about this and it is intentional. I will ask guys whether we will change it or not. It also largely depends on feedback from players. Thank you for report though.
    **********

    All we are asking is WHY even release these small ship versions of the blastdoor block if it does not work like the large ship versions.
    We DID NOT know it was not your job, The fact that your the only person with Developer related to your sign in name and that your the one replying to our problem reports with things like "we know we are working on a fix" kinda got us thinking you WERE our rep from Keen, If this is not the case then who is our link to the Dev Team, and more importantly why are they leaving the communication with their community to you instead of doing it themselves and making you out to be our Developer contact..... Again very sorry to make you feel put upon, that was not my intention but you did reply saying it was intentional and we can't figure out why the Dev team would intentionally give us blocks which dont work like the larger counterparts do.....

    In Conclusion we, me mostly, appologise for making you feel bad, Please continue helping us by giving us hope that the team is helping us, and please try and find out what the actual situation is with why the small ship blastdoors do no act like their larger ship versions. Thankyou very very much.
     
  15. Phand Master Engineer

    Messages:
    9,650
    Hi,

    there is truly no need. :) I know it is intentional - it is. It maybe bad design, but you know I did not design it myself...All I can do is ask the guys. I created ticket for this and I am waiting for reply. Also some of design decisions are team decisions, personally I sometimes disagree as well, but since I am over-voted I have to get along. But we are listening to feedback, so the more people will demand change, the ore the probability this will get changed.
     
  16. JayCo2013 Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    356
    Thanks for the reply Phand, and thanks for putting in the ticket.
    Do you know why it is intentional though, thats what is making no sense to us, to release blocks which appear the same as the large ship version but dont work the same is confusing to us.
    Why even bother to release the small block if we can't use it?????

    Unconfuse us please.....
     
  17. koosemose Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    1
    I thought this weeks update (01.043) may have fixed the issue after reading: [SIZE= 13.3333330154419px]- fixed small ship blast doors preventing placing of other blocks nearby
    [/SIZE][SIZE= 13.3333330154419px]but it doesn't seem to have, and after further testing, this bug-fix doesn't seem to have actually worked, as I can't place any other blocks around small ship blast doors (except on the two sides that are visually pulled away from the block edges). And even on the thin sides, when raising and lowering a blast door something is catching on those blocks (due to the timing I'm guessing it's the corners, but I can't be certain).[/SIZE]
     
  18. TheDeinonychus Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    88
    This seems like a very questionable design choice if it is indeed intentional. Honestly, I can not see the purpose for preventing blast doors from working on small ships as they do on large ships.
     
  19. Chaotic_Knightmare Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    4
    I was unaware that this was even a problem, i have only been using the blast doors on stations as the rotors and pistons were unreliable on ships when on a dedicated server. But this is something i hope gets fixed soon seeing as i attempted a nice sealed door on my "large" small ship and could not figure out why i couldn't get the blocks to fit correctly, or place them at all. Please Devs fix this soon.
     
  20. ctd291 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    31
    I have an issue with this as well I make almost all of my ships in small ship blocks and am tired of having to deal with explosions and gaps. Please fix this devs!
     
  21. Kristian Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    4
    I can confirm, this is still an issue. Blastdoor blocks for small ships are purelly for decorative purposes as of now... Please, allow us to make ramps and doors for our epic spacecrafts ;__;
     
  22. Pjosip Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    9
    Hey, after noticing strange behavor of small ship blast doors in a way that they behave noticably diffrent than large ship/station blast doors I have decided to Search the forums in order to find if it is a bug and if I can fix it.
    I am sad to see this kind of behavor is intended, I do not understand why and would apritiate if @Phand could get an awnser from the devs, I most certainly support changing small ship blast doors so they are consistent with their larger versions.

    And if needed I am also in favor of creating a poll in a noticable area (Perhaps announcments? I apologies for my lack of knowlage this is basically my First time using the forums and am unfamiliar with it's structure.) where customers can give their input about this subject, I believe this would be the most productive way of presenting the issue to other in the dev team.

    Also as being a QA tester both inside and outside a company (with the difference being similar to the difference of official PR employee and a Administrator) I know how you feel ;)

    Now onto changing my avatar & signature, btw am I allowed to link to my YouTube channel in the signature?
     
  23. KingdomBragg Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    544
    Bump because I thought this was a bug so I searched the forum and found this thread.

    I mostly build medium sized ships from small ship blocks and nearly all of them have been adversely affected by this: ramps, doors, etc all require large gaps around them which ruin the design.

    Please change small ship blast doors to work the same as the large ship blast doors.
     
  24. Harag Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    913
    Intentional or not, I published a mod that replaces the collision models.
     
  25. ctd291 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    31
    Thank you! You are awesome!
     
  26. Rizzitoni Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    306
    Phand,
    Please accept my vote to also adjust the collision meshes on small blocks. We need small things to work just like their larger counterparts. Otherwise we can't seem to build the same types of things we can with larger blocks and make it impossible. Also, this makes for a more consistent build experience when using small and large blocks for better engineering results.

    Thanks for all your hard work Phand. Some folks don't realize how chaotic the bug report section was before you came to be our liaison with the developers. Things actually get prioritized and fixed now :)

    Maybe the devs can just ask Harag for his mod to fix this :p
     
  27. Petite_patte Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    82
    + 1 need to be fixed or have an answer ...
     
  28. Doan04 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    21
    Is there still no fix for this?
    The mod is nice, but I want the vanilla version to work properly.
     
Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.