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Celestial bodies discussion

Discussion in 'Suggestions and Feedback' started by Tazoo, Nov 6, 2013.

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This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. KissSh0t Master Engineer

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    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2015
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  2. Ninjaturkey Apprentice Engineer

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    I wasn't especially a pro- or con- planet player before this thread, but now I understand that planets divide the community and should be done wisely, otherwise it could take too much (if it isn't all) of the gameplay


    I'm myself an old player of Garrysmod and KSP since their beginning and it is a good thing to build Space engineers with other "partial sandbox" games in mind

    First, we need to determine:
    if the survival mode needs to be more Sandbox-like and be based on serious roleplay within the community to make a good gameplay
    or survival oriented and make hazards and Enemy AI's difficulty prevail over the rest
    or both

    What my experience told me about Garrysmod SpaceBuild mod is that, a smaller universe with tiny planets is fun and makes people find each other more easily
    I fear that large planets would make a bunch of useless environments to explore (and decrease your framerate)

    Kerbal space program offer a solution by limiting the solar system size and with the possibility of scanning surfaces for players structures, even large planets would be okay to play with,
    but I recognise that Space engineers wouuld become 50% "Planets/Surface Engineers" and orient gameplay also towards cars

    The question of gravity is also to resolve, implementing planet gravity (and air friction like in Kerbal) would be madness

    I Think that very small celestial bodies,but large enough for base establishment would be okay, with the difference in comparison with asteroids, would be gravity and high atmosphere to make spaceship unable to target the surface from outter space

    Keen as to establish a framework, modders will then make the gameplays people want
    I thinl right now about tome "planetay anihilation" mod, with 2 planets facing each other and players having to build first on the surface to destroy the enemy
     
  3. mpkhryz2 Trainee Engineer

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    do not worry i think planets will be able to be disable
     
  4. mpkhryz2 Trainee Engineer

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    i agree... totaly
     
  5. mpkhryz2 Trainee Engineer

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    it will be opcional, and if not so, we will need many jumpdrivers
     
  6. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    To put this in context, you agree that without planets Space Engineers is "more or less build your own mario cart and smash it into the wall"?
     
  7. tomasara413 Trainee Engineer

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    I have to ask you: What does space contain? Your answer should be like: asteroids, stars, nebulas,planets... Or I really don't know what have you expected in space. I understand what do you mean, but that's progression and you can still stay in space and do everything you like. Also that doesn't mean you will not get corporations and that kind of stuff.
     
  8. Ninjaturkey Apprentice Engineer

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    With or without planets doesn't change much the gameplay in my opinion
    If the planets are empty, they are just like large asteroids (with some added gravity hype fun)
    SE needs a larger gameplay content update, there is not much thing to do (without considering multiplayer interactions), I hihly want your pirates, mercenaries, AI things filling up space but that's not the question of planets or not planets.

    I want planets because, SE "space landscape" feels empty with only asteroids

    Also with a link with the previous "Exploration update", ships tends to be so rare to find, planets offer natural crash sites to find them (damaged of course)
     
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  9. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    The larger gameplay content update is forthcoming, although it's not going to happen soon. Current asteroids and the soon-to-be-released planets are placeholders. The way they are now is not how they will be when the game is released. That being said, we have the scenario editor today and intelligent NPC's are in the works. Little by little, space will fill up with plenty of interesting things.

    The SE "space landscape" feels empty because space is mostly empty. Planets don't fill the void. They simply introduce a different environment. An environment that we are familiar with and can deal with more easily based on our real life experience. We have essentially already solved all of the engineering challenges for any celestial body SE can provide. The only real issue is getting the blocks available in the game to perform the way we expect them to. Ship drills work better on a ship in zero gravity than they do attached to a vehicle stuck on the ground because of gravity. The ingenuity and cleverness required to accomplish just about anything in space is exponentially greater than anything required to accomplish the same thing on a planet, because we've already done it on planets. Specifically, this one.

    The very idea that a planet would be a "natural crash site" for a spacecraft shows that your thinking is still earthbound. Ships crash on islands. Planes crash-land in the boonies. Delelict spacecraft may actually still manage to avoid crashing if they still function. If they have succumbed to the gravity well of a planet, whatever's left is probably worthless. Things just work differently in space.
     
  10. Ninjaturkey Apprentice Engineer

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    I agree they are "placeholders", and planets are fine because an asteroid only world is quite boring (IMO)
    AI are definitely coming too

    As for crash site, you are right, but considering there is no "deadly heat entry"(KSP like...) in SE and that they have a great gravity attraction, that would have been a logical place to see crashed large ships or at least debris.
    And even if it's not realistic, a ship crashed after an emergency or fuel shortage is still fun if it is somewhat aerodynamic.
     
  11. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    Point taken. A derelict ship that is not functioning will not survive
    a landing. A functioning derelict ship may well survive such a landing, as would a player's ship that has suffered some misfortune due to combat or meteor strikes. The challenge then would be to get back off the planet which, given the way planets are turning out, would not be easy. I have seen many videos of people successfully landing on planets, yet I have not seen one where someone successfully left one.

    Atmospheric friction would be a nice mechanic.
     
  12. Ninjaturkey Apprentice Engineer

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    That is better that way, Large ship shouldn't be able to come and go away that easily, but if it did nothing to powerful small ship I wouldn't mind (eg. Interstellar the movie)
     
  13. Geko L*76G Trainee Engineer

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    When planets do come out, I think that the small details will really count, for example simple swooshes and whistles when you fly a small ship in atmosphere and maybe even some birds, on a bigger scale there could be storms that do damage to your station like sand storms or even just rain that might do a bit of flooding, I don't really know but I think there should definitely be different sound effects when in atmosphere like the swooshing etc because its the details that make a game awesome.
     
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  14. Sliyther Trainee Engineer

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    i agree! on the subject on sandstorms, really cool ideas by the way. i was thinking of desert planets, Where sand/dirt voxels can break easily and have lower friction. Maybe on wheels/blocks they could add particle effects, so you can dig a trench while spinning out! Possibly get yourself stuck (if driving a racecar in sand dunes)? Would definitely be awesome!
     
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  15. mdenz3 Apprentice Engineer

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    Looks like a 100km planet is going to take 50 minutes to get around at the surface with the current speed limit. They really need to raise the limit.
     
  16. MaxTheManiac Apprentice Engineer

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    Does anyone know if planets will have multiple biomes and things like poles with ice caps? Because they should! :woot:
     
  17. Kira Apprentice Engineer

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    All the people crying for strictly modern NASA technology in a game set more than 60 years in the future are not only ludicrously oblivious to how quickly technology moves, but they are also wearing down my patience.

    NO LASERS! TOO SCIFI!
    Despite Already having lasers powerful enough to shoot down missiles. So laser technology is just going to halt for 60 years?

    We have gravity drives people. That is the most SCIFI physics breaking thing conceivable and it's already in the game. Let keen add fun stuff to the game. If you don't like it, don't use it. How hard is that? A lot of people didn't like oxygen. Hence we have an on off option for it.

    I used to be anti planets and anti oxygen. Now I've realized it adds a lot of fun to the game I didn't expect. Try not to be so narrow minded. Anyone who thinks this game is anywhere close to being a sim of any kind is out of touch with sim gaming. This is a SCIFI game. It's been one since gravity generators and artificial mass were put in. Don't like it? KSP is calling.

    TL;DR
    the game is unrealistic. Deal with it.
     
  18. Kira Apprentice Engineer

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    The reason photos seem to hint towards that.
     
  19. Lleajy Trainee Engineer

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    I've few questions :

    Will the orbit be a realistic one ?
    About the rotation of the sun, can't they set it in function of your position, every planet would have a variable that represents its rotation speed and one that is its movement in space (could be something totally arbitrary) ? On the planet you would have the rotation + the planet speed, once you get in orbit, you have the movement in space setting the sun movement. I know it doesn't make the planet move but this would be a good middle ground between what we have atm and the reality.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2015
  20. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    Did you read this part of what you quoted?:
    "I can probably say with confidence this is the most Sci-fi we're going to get, but its no more sci-fi than the gravity generators we already have, and as people understand; they're there for the purpose of gameplay also.

    Its difficult to explain fully, but when planets hit (Soon ™) you guys will understand why we added it. We're not going mental or deviating from our original goals, just thinking of gameplay."
     
  21. Kira Apprentice Engineer

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    Who cares if that was the original goal? The game is scifi period. If you're so stuck up on them keeping to their original goals SE should be shutdown and we should wait for the miner wars mmo. I for one am glad that they saw they needed to adopt scifi elements for the sake of gameplay.
     
  22. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    I care, and Keen Software House cares.​

    Sci-Fi does not mean automatically throwing in everything every other sci-fi thing had or has. What you want is in conflict with what the people making the game want. If that was not true the stuff you want would be in there already as there is no technical or physical limitation. Keen wants the game to have an identity. They did not envision Space Engineers being a catch-all sci-fi game where anything can happen, especially if you needle them enough about it. I am not stuck up on them keeping their goals. Keen Software House is committed to making a game set in a specific time period with a specific level of technology, yet for those that want to use SE as a platform to play something else they have opened the game to modding with their full support. That way they can avoid deviating from their original goals. It's a commendable attitude, and you should respect it.
     
  23. Kira Apprentice Engineer

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    Again I can't help but point out. Technology in SE is supposed to be based in 2070..... If you don't think we will have weaponized lasers in 2070 when we are already building and testing them, you're totally out of touch with how technology advances. Do you think laser technology is just gonna halt and stop advancing for another 55 years? The thing is, most of the 'scifi' stuff people are asking for are very feasible to emerge in 55 years. I remember people thinking a little pad computer that you can hold was a ridiculous idea on Star Trek. Yet look at what I'm writing this post on. Shields. Yeah. Arguably that's unrealistic. But there's no reasonable argument against weaponized lasers when we are already using weaponized lasers.
     
  24. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    Well, two things.

    One, directed energy weapons are pure fantasy. Lasers were developed by the telephone company. That's right. It was a product of Bell Labs, a subsidiary of AT&T back when AT&T was The Telephone Company. The lab was trying to find a way to send a signal over long distances. They found that if they flashed a light through a ruby crystal what came out the other end was a single frequency, which they could manipulate. Good for phone calls. Not a big deal for weapons. Of course, by this time we had had 20 years of ray guns in comics and movies, so eventually the military looked into the possibilities. Turns out the thing about lasers is that in order to get the kind of energy needed to do damage you need an industrial strength power supply. As far as the technology goes, lasers have essentially reached their limit. The ruby crystal was almost immediately replaced by a synthetic crystal, and the high-power lasers use a tube filled with various gasses. The output is entirely dependent on the input, and that's where the technology in 2077 bears a striking resemblance to 2015. If laser weapons are going to at least compete with kinetic weapons they would need to be portable and possess a rate of fire and level of damage equal or superior to it's kinetic counterpart. It would also need to cost about the same. The laser was invented about 60 years ago. It's already had 60 years of intense research as a potential weapon. After all that time we now have a weapon that kinda works sometimes but it seems no branch of our military really wants it.

    Two, this thread is about planets.
     
  25. KissSh0t Master Engineer

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    I wonder if the deeper you dig into a planet.. will there be different layers in the planet..

    If you did too deep, will you find magma?

    Precious stones maybe? Other types of rare ores?
     
  26. Stardriver907 Master Engineer

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    I think all the standard ore will be deep and perhaps larger deposits. You maybe won't find every ore on every planet but you might find a large deposit or two of one or another. Planets may be the go-to place for "organic material" as I has seen this watching Twitch streams of people playing on planets.
     
  27. Nic_s Trainee Engineer

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    Planets should be where you get different kinds of food types for survival.

    It can maybe also be nice if you can potentially find upgraded technology on planets. For example: You can find better thruster or Reactor tech on a planet, but it won't be a new item in the game it will just make what you have a little better. Maybe have a tiering system where you can have up to tier 3 thrusters, but planets with crashed ships or abandoned bases is the only places you could find these upgrades.
     
  28. gruller65 Trainee Engineer

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    Actu
    Actually shields are in development look up ,plasma pen shielding ,
    Jump drives..in development we need fusion again in development,railguns in development,cloaking,guess what in development, ion thrusters developed,guided bullets in development ,lasers developed and weaponised,nukes developed weaponised,artificial gravity....undevelped
    Exoskeletons developed weaponised

    So you say syfy realllly think cuz your "syfy" is an old thought process wake up people this shit Is real

    Se is baced in a time that we WILLhave this tech
    Ion computing in development
    Look up what's real and what's completely fake
    Se tech is modern tech and a bit of future tech and some fantasy tech everything that is disputed as syfy is mostly real shiznit
    Stuf that already exists
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2015
  29. gruller65 Trainee Engineer

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    Gra
    Reverse gravity generators n mass blocks
     
  30. gruller65 Trainee Engineer

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    R
    Reentry desnt have to cause damage it could just be a effect
     
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