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Halloween Update 1.184.6 - Skin Crafting & Ghost Skin

Discussion in 'Change Log' started by flexx, Oct 26, 2017.

Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. halipatsui Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,253

    Oh that
    It has been around since i started playing in summer of 2016
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. TheDeinonychus Trainee Engineer

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    87
    Just how much of a system drain was thruster damage in the first place? Considering my game still chugs if I spend too much time near a planet, I'm willing to bet that this was a case of something the devs could easily 'fix' and still claim to have improved performance no matter how small of an impact it made. If it's still something that needs changed, I agree that the damage area should be restricted to only the width of the actual thruster nozzle rather than the entire block. With the extra bulk around large thrusters, this means they have an absurd damage area you have to leave exposed.

    To those that say this is more 'real', firstly this isn't Kerbal. Secondly, the other half of the thruster change already throws realism out the window. Thrusters should not be causing damage to block behind other blocks at the same time. Whatever 'exploit' this claims to fix was never a problem in the first place. Exploits are only exploits if they give a player an unfair advantage, such as duplicating items or taking advantage of physics to move at insane speeds (google 'Clang Drive' to see what I mean). At best this could be considered a 'misfeature', something unintended that actually improves the gameplay for most players.

    This is a case where efficiency and 'realism' should take a back seat to gameplay. Remember, it doesn't matter how efficient or realistic a game is if it stops being fun to play. And yes, this is a change that causes more frustration for players than it solves.

    Like Whiplash suggested, the simple fix would be to reduce the size of the 'ouchie box' so it's more in line with the size of the actual thruster nozzel, rather than the entire block itself. As for how thrusters apply damage to blocks in front of them, the old method was simply better. It made sense, where as this new method of 'burn everything at once' makes no sense and just seems lazy. Again, it doesn't matter if the new method is faster, the result is illogical. And honestly, I doubt many people (if any) were complaining about 'thruster damage lag'.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Late Late x 2
  3. halipatsui Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,253

    Computationally lighter is computationally lighter.
    Small streams eventually form rivers.
    As do small performance costs in number eventually create lag.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  4. PandaTv Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    13
    pls give us update for kick who not player 2 sek join and ban list ( for not server game )
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  5. Whiplash141 Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    958
    The circle in this image is the thruster flame plume. It appears that the initial implementation of this thruster damage system change damages blocks way outside the range of the thrust flame.

    As noted in this post, thruster damage volumes are significantly larger than their nozzles and thrust flame would suggest
    And I'll replug my image illustrating this:
    [​IMG]

    The main issue with this new system is that it is not intuitive for new or experienced players since the damage ranges don't match the thruster flame/nozzle at all.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
  6. I23I7 ME Tester

    Messages:
    3,827
    Run a grid throuhg 3x3 :) and observe how it doesnt change much since the "squares concerned" are still the same. But yeah programmers are looking into being able to place corner blocks for decorations.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  7. krypt-lynx Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    175
    @I23I7, Issue affects all thrusters of any type, size and grid:
    Damage zone aligned to grid now - it affects thin blocks what was possible to use: windows, catwalks, cameras, etc. I'm posted an example in this thread.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  8. Whiplash141 Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    958
    I'm honestly having trouble understanding what you are describing. Care to draw a simple paint sketch for me?

    And yeah, this irks me. Almost all of the cool decorations we could use are now broke :/
     
  9. Ondřej Nahálka QA Lead Staff

    Messages:
    88
    Hey,

    it's possible that Steam had an error and downloaded bad data. Please go to %appdata%\SpaceEngineers\Mods and delete all files. That should fix it.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. octacore Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    9
    Theres also 'now' an annoying bug on DS:
    An attached grid to voxel, cut off from the voxel can desync the entire server. The fun is all data from clients are still processed but not refreshed by server in the other way around.
     
  11. LostSoul3471 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    28
    You all are so close to the solution of the thruster damage issue. I can see it being possible that a smaller ouchy box (love that) inside the radius of the original cylinder would still yield the same damage to say 1x2 slope corner but have you thought about rotating the box 45 degrees so you have diamond as the ouchy box? Calculation wise I can't see it being much different and you're still talking about the same poly to draw and in theory would clear the above example.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  12. I23I7 ME Tester

    Messages:
    3,827
    Make 3x3 square on a piece of paper and draw the circle inside it like you have on your picture. Now with the same proportion draw a square inside the circle. You will see that the corner squares are still touched by the "damage" square. Therefore reducing the size will not help at all but again we know that the decoration that are in the corner of those squares should not be targeted.
    --- Automerge ---
    Can you elaborate please?
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. krypt-lynx Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    175
    This circle does not touched square previously. Whiplash141 done wrong drawing in first place.
    --- Automerge ---
    3x3:
    [​IMG]
    1x1:
    [​IMG]
     
  14. I23I7 ME Tester

    Messages:
    3,827
    But then you get large thrusters that damage only on block behind them.
     
  15. Thomas Theurer Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    4
    After installing the Hotfix and deleting all files in the MODS folder, all issues are solved. We're back !
    Thx
     
    • Like Like x 4
  16. Ondřej Nahálka QA Lead Staff

    Messages:
    88
    Hey Octacore,

    please provide the video if it is possible.

    Is it 100 % reproducable?

    Thank you!
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  17. krypt-lynx Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    175
    It was almost in this way: it was possible to put 1x2 slope base in corner. I'm not sure about half block on edge, trough.
    This ship from current workshop top:
    Look at large ion thrusters
     
  18. crashandburn Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    55
    So you're saying that this has the same damage area on both cases??? That would imply that thruster damage is applied to the entire grid block that is touched by the 'flame'. Which has to be some of the laziest programming ever.
    [​IMG]
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
  19. Forcedminer Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    2,225
    any modded looking to recreate the old style of thrusters into an optional mod? :p
    hasn't affected me because all my ships are blocky and crap but functional.
    last time i tried styling my ship all the atmospheric thrusters all disintegrated as i picked up some speed.
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
  20. Vicizlat Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    174
    I don't think the width of the damage can be manipulated. There may be a way trough scripting but I don't know.
    From the CubeBlocks.sbc you can see that you can change the amount of damage and the damage length but not width:

    Code:
          <FlameDamageLengthScale>0.6</FlameDamageLengthScale>
          <FlameDamage>0.1</FlameDamage>
    
    Taken from Small Ion Thruster.
     
  21. Whiplash141 Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    958
    This is not what I am saying. The damage should be applied along the flame not the entire bounding box of the thruster:
    [​IMG]

    Basic point is that the damage box needs to be more fine tuned to make sense to players because as it stands now, it is quite excessive. The current implementation very badly represents the damage potential suggested by the thruster flames (which is all we have to go off of).

    This bounding box could easily be tuned to make it better approximate the old thruster damage models.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
  22. krypt-lynx Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    175
    It isn't approximation at all now. My test stows current damage zone is have size of placement box.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  23. Thales M. Senior Engineer

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    1,001
    Thruster damage is not working in my game.
    [​IMG]
     
  24. Whiskey2049 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    13
    There's a lot of angry players with this release mostly because of the paid skin and delay of the major/anniversary update which people thought would bring new features last thursday. I think it would be good if you guys told us what you're working on, what to expect from the major and why the release got delayed. I think open communication could help calm things down.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
  25. darth_crunchus Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    239
    Oh, okay. Yeah, that's definitely an issue lol


    EDIT: To devs: I've been experiencing persistent crashes on game exit. Doesn't matter if I've been in game for an hour, or if I just launch the game, and click "Quit to Windows". It crashes regardless. I even tried rebooting, restarting STEAM, and even reinstalling SE itself, to no avail. If there's the need for log data, what should I look for? I don't normally delve into error logs.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2017
  26. Whiplash141 Junior Engineer

    Messages:
    958
    That is... unfortunate :/

    He said keen is working on it so we can only hope for a swift resolution to the issue.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  27. Whitehawk001 Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    5
    this is BUSHIT (intensionally spelled wrong)
    THE FUCKIN landin gears burn on your own lander now
     
    • Funny Funny x 4
    • Agree Agree x 2
  28. halipatsui Senior Engineer

    Messages:
    1,253

    Rexxar actually answered this one on discord.
    He said that it is expensive to do because it would require multi-threading sensors to avoid creating lag.
    Its known issue but it apparently takes yoo much dev time when more important tasks are at hand
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  29. DemeterHUN Trainee Engineer

    Messages:
    9
    Oh, that is a shame. It eliminates so much gameplay from the game. Thanks for the info tho.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  30. darth_crunchus Apprentice Engineer

    Messages:
    239
    I'm assuming "intensionally" was unintentionally spelled wrong? I'm just giving you a hard time, btw lol
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
Thread Status:
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