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Shadows not dark anymore!?

Discussion in 'General' started by Inferi, Aug 20, 2015.

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This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. Inferi Apprentice Engineer

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    138
    What has happend to the shadows in dx11!? Its just as bright as in dx9 now ...
    Before it was dark as the backside of the moon but now I see everything in the shadows... light also bleeding through the blocks in some places!?

    Have they changed this or is a new bug, or even worse, is it only me that have this problem now!? ...
     
  2. Malware Master Engineer

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    They changed it. :(
     
  3. PsicoPato Senior Engineer

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    Nope not a problem, kids where afraid of the dark(i like the dark :() and cryed out so loud that the devs needed to make the use of flashlights and other light sources a total useles thing. Now i will cry so devs can bring the darkness back.

    Now before someone come and bash me with a rock, i do believe that the light system need a fix, and the performance problems with too many lights is a real problem, but we can't just trash out features just because you'r having problems in an ALPHA (yea i said alpha) game.

    I just hope they put the darknes back when we reach a more stable version of the game.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2015
    • Like Like x 2
  4. Inferi Apprentice Engineer

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    138
    Nice to know its not just me who loved the dark shadows. I really hope they will make it dark again :)
     
    • Like Like x 4
  5. Malware Master Engineer

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    Yes they can, that's the purpose of this stage, to figure out what works and what don't. (Please consider this a softball rather than a rock :D)

    nitpick: Early access, not alpha. Almost the same, but not exactly. It does indeed give your "don't change" statement some credence but they must be allowed to do major changes in this stage.

    Frankly, in my opinion they should cut their losses and kill XP and DX9 support in its entirety, it's holding the game back, causing a double workload and preventing them from updating to the most recent code libraries.

    Indeed.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2015
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  6. SirLANsalot Apprentice Engineer

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    If Lights and Spotlights didn't cause MAJOR frame rate loss and just massive Sim speed Lag, I wouldn't have any issues with pure dark shadows, it makes those things needed......however since we do not have good performance with lights, the shadows as they are now, are ok.
     
  7. PsicoPato Senior Engineer

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    Yea you'r right i should have vented my anger before posting anything, i really need a bether "vent system" on my head.

    I just... loved that dark, you know, we where such close friends. He was allways there, watching me weld my ships and laughing at me everytime i would die because i hited a dam wall while not being able to see nothing.
     
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  8. Bumber Senior Engineer

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    1,018
    They probably fiddled with the eye adjustment, but it looks like it's due for more fixing:
     
  9. Zyfe Trainee Engineer

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    64
    You should actually rename this thread to:

    "Shadows are non-existent in DX11"

    Please Keen, Please give us the ability to change the shadow settings in DX11. Right now it's completely absurd. If I make an enclosed space with no lights, it should be near pitch black. Right now it's as bright as the sun! There is literally no reason to use lights in the game and everything is washed out. There's no feeling of being in space and it's quite ugly.

    I really hope they don't plan on leaving it like this, or at least provide us the ability to modify it to our liking.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. iN5URG3NT Senior Engineer

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    1,132
    This. Seems ridiculous for a game in 2015.
     
  11. chemicalscum Apprentice Engineer

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    I really would like to see the complete darkness back. Where there is no light, it should be black. The automatic brightness adjustment is really annoying, leave that part to our own eyes please. I never liked that a lot in most games, but in SE it's way too extreme.
     
    • Like Like x 4
  12. Thedevistator Senior Engineer

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    1,942
    XP support I agree, but directX9 is still used by a lot of people and it causes frame rate issues for some. Not only that, but since the game was released with directX9 they have to keep that backwards compatibility.
     
  13. chemicalscum Apprentice Engineer

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    318
    [​IMG]
     
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  14. Bumber Senior Engineer

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    1,018
    Only if they can make lights actually work worth a damn, though. They aren't supposed to be small spheres of illumination that instantly fade to darkness outside their radius. Real lights reflect off surfaces and stack additively with one another. A room with enough small lights in it should start to become fully illuminated.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. chemicalscum Apprentice Engineer

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    318
    They work, especially in dx9, they just need a bit of tweaking.
     
  16. Commander Rotal Master Engineer

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    The screeny with the darkness has turned out to indeed be a hardcore bug (basically two Interior Lights opposite to each other in close proximity seem to cancel each other out); this one is way, way more representative (and also shows one of the major problems of wanting the DX11 Blindfold back: even at max settings the Interior Lights, which eat up performance as-is (as-are?), have a ridicilously small area of effect, four blocks. In this four block high room they don't even reach the ceiling. Also, as others have adressed, SE's lighting is not up to the task performance-wise, and considering DX9 hasn't changed and that the opposition-bug produces the same extreme shadows the DX11 Blindfold was probably a bug to begin with and was only fixed. (Again, would be nice to get some dev word on that... but you kow...)

    [​IMG]

    I still like the way it works right now; unlit rooms are by no means bright but now they're playable again and once you start using lighting you have to keep using it otherwise your eye adjustment will darken everything else (compare the unlit areas in the screenshot above with the unlit everything in one of the quoted ones above.) . If people want the Blindfold back as a checkbox, by all means, you got my vote, but keep that thing out of my face. (It's bad enough that the game is now throwing goddamn rice at me at high velocities... i mean seriously...)
     
  17. Malware Master Engineer

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    They most certainly don't have to, even if I agree it may possibly be a bad idea PR wise not to - depending on how many actually have to use DX9. Early access "everything is subject to change". DX9 support causes Keen to have to maintain two separate renderers, two separate sets of materials, two sets of textures etc. DX9 and DX11 is not compatible. DX9 was released 13 years ago. Time for people to move on.

    None of these things will happen, so the game will never be what it could be.
     
  18. Malware Master Engineer

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    That kind of lighting is approximatable with modern hardware, but very performance intensive.
     
  19. Bumber Senior Engineer

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    I could imagine how they might fake it like with room pressure, but exterior lights would be somewhat more difficult.
     
  20. Harag Junior Engineer

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    Dropping DX9 and WinXP support would mean they'd have to adjust their minimum specs. That would probably be a clear sign to a lot of customers that they are forever locked out from a product they already payed for and may qualify them for a refund. That's not a place you'd like to be in as a game developer.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  21. entspeak Senior Engineer

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    Where is Balmung when you need him?! :)
     
  22. Malware Master Engineer

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    Yes that might work... on exterior lights you wouldn't have as much to reflect on, so it may not be all that bad.
     
  23. Malware Master Engineer

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    I am fully aware of this, and it won't happen, but a man can dream.

    DX9 is one thing, that's merely about work hours. XP, however: As long as XP is a thing, they can't upgrade the .NET version, but must stick to .NET 4. Also, they can't upgrade to the latest SharpDX with the improvements there, and also without that DX12 support can never be a thing. Not that I think it would any time soon anyway, but still.
     
  24. entspeak Senior Engineer

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    1,744
    Turning off tonemapping helps a bit.
     
  25. Harag Junior Engineer

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    There is of course a way. Increase the minimum specs now but keep the support until things like the EU's two year minimum warranty period runs out and after that drop support for DX9, WinXP, etc. But then again, that would be two years from now :rolleyes:
     
  26. entspeak Senior Engineer

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    Would that be two years from now? Or two years from when the game was introduced?
     
  27. Harag Junior Engineer

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    Two years from the time of sale - and presumably the game is still bought to this day. But then again... IANAL.
     
Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.