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Space Engineers - The Biggest MMO of All Time

Discussion in 'General' started by HR, Oct 25, 2015.

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This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. Malware Master Engineer

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    Exactly. I'd prefer it stay that way, if I'm given a choice.
     
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  2. Lrj52 Apprentice Engineer

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    I'm going to try and explain my post about cross server travel quickly:

    The way I see it could work would be when you create a dedicated server, you would have the option to choose to allow people to use the jump drive (or a similar system) to teleport to your world, at the cost of not allowing mods to be added to the server. Single player would obviously still exist, as would dedicated servers how they work now, and player hosted games would not have this option. As the server transfer part is already in the code thanks to the github merge, not much would have to be done for this to be possible.

    This way, people who only play single player wouldn't have it forced upon them, nor would the people who simply don't like this idea, while those who do would get what they want. Just an idea, some other stuff would have to be worked out.
     
  3. DDP-158 Master Engineer

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    You prefer chaos ad griefing or private servers?
     
  4. Malware Master Engineer

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    Private servers, every time. Have you misunderstood my standing in this matter? I was responding to
     
  5. Tineoidea Trainee Engineer

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    OP, the game you are searching for is called "EVE Online". At least it's the only really large scaled sandbox (especially in a scifi context) that comes to my mind. But that one is not about engineering (unless we are talking about social engineering).
    And yes, in such a sandbox the bad players (grr goons) will come and kick down your sandcastle just because they can.

    While some (like me) may find something like this quite interesting, I highly doubt that would appeal to the rest of the userbase.

    Speaking future-wise: At some point there will be a Space Engineers-like game (engineering and voxels), that is an actual MMO, but that is still in the future, speaking of the capabilities that servers provide right now. A combination of SE and EVE sounds like a wet dream for me tho.
     
  6. fourthquantum Senior Engineer

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    If SE became the biggest MMO of all time then I image keen would be extremely happy with all the money they would be rolling in.
     
  7. noxLP Junior Engineer

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    MMOs are totally different than a co-op multiplayer or a simple low-amount-of-people/private server competitive multiplayer. There are a huge lot of games co-op and competitive, counter strike, battlefield, DoD, CoD, LoL, red faction, even the older AoE and warcraft II.
    All that games have little in common(for not saying almost nothing) with a MMO like UO, lineage, Mu online(i don't even know if this still exists), WoW, Conan, guild wars and so on, basically the only thing they have in common is the multiplayer thing, the rest like features, mechanics, how the devs gain money, the type of people you find playing the game most of the times, how most gamers behave in game and what's their expectations about the game, almost all is different in a MMO than in a game that simply "have multiplayer".

    And honestly that's why i don't want SE to be a MMO, i don't play MMOs since years ago and i will not play SE as a MMO. Don't misunderstand me, as allways everyone can play the game the way they want it, if it can happen with a trick like the gate between servers, i think that's really good, BUT take in mind that like 99% (i'm saying 99% but i don't know anyone) of MMOs don't have the possibility to play them in other way than MMOs, no SP and no simple multiplayer... so, no, i don't want SE to be a pure MMO, by no means.

    Edit: Sorry, i have to correct myself here, i have played Neverwinter nights I and II as MMO, co-op and SP, so i know 2 MMOs that have that possibility :p
     
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  8. Lrj52 Apprentice Engineer

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    To be honest, I agree that SE should not become a full MMO. Again, I think the cross server travel idea is an interesting and viable one, but mainly because of its plausibility and how it doesn't force the idea of large scale multiplayer on anyone. It won't make the game an MMO, but would give people the option to not be limited to 50 player max (in the future, that is) servers. Just want to state this so I don't look like a crazy, opinionated douche trying to make everyone want what I wish for. ;)

    (I will shut up about the cross server travel thing now, I promise)
     
  9. Kephyr Apprentice Engineer

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    All multiplayer games that you listed are match making games. Which are obviously different from games like WOW, GW, or EVE. Space Engineers multiplayer, however, is already closer MMO games than match making games (that is if we don't include scenarios), because the servers become their own "persistent universes". They are small, compared to universes like one in EVE, but they are ideologically similar.

    It's totally cool to prefer single player. I wouldn't want SE to become an only MMO game either, because I love prototyping in creative, and playing on a server with just my friends every now and then is great too. Taking the current single player and multiplayer options away is a terrible idea, and I'm sure that no one who supports SE being an MMO wants that.

    If SE becomes an MMO, no, I should word that better - if SE develops a separate, developer-supported MMO server, all other play options will still be available. I can't stress that enough.

    What we, supporters of SE MMO want, is (sorry for repeating myself, but I feel like that's the only way to get the point across) just a separate, developer-backed dedicated server with support of a large amount of players, and some supporting features like a better communication system and trade system (currency and etc).

    Some people would probably even pay a subscription for just an access to that server. I know I would cancel my EvE subscription in a heartbeat to jump onto SEO :). And that, in turn would help maintain the big server.
     
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  10. Super_Happy_Alien Apprentice Engineer

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    Are your not just really Saying Freelancer/Elite ? with the SE Engines ????
     
  11. Ash87 Senior Engineer

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    I'm going to start keeping count of how many times this topic comes up...

    For the millionth time: No!
     
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  12. Kephyr Apprentice Engineer

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    @Ash87 Naysaying is detrimental to progress :) KSH were initially against planets, which lead to people supporting their position saying "go mine asteroids instead because planets aren't coming". Look where we are now.
     
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  13. BlackUmbrellas Senior Engineer

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    Yeah, if there's one thing Space ENgineers doesn't need, it's a Goonswarm.
     
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  14. EmperorDragon Apprentice Engineer

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    Another droplet in the vast ocean of existing MMOs? No thanks! Keen can do as they please in regard to multiplayer but it is important to maintain the offline functionality of SE on the same level, not just some half-baked complementary singleplayer mode.

    Not everyone can be on the internet permanently, it would not be wise for Keen to kill off much of it's customer base by incurring additional costs and services by forcing players online. The gaming market is already flooded with all sorts of MMOs and internet-dependent games, a new and innovative offline space game is badly needed for a change and, since games like Star Citizen and Elite has given half the gaming community the finger with all their online restrictions, Space Engineers fills the gap perfectly. Sure, weekly updates can take a huge chunck of prepaid mobile data for offline players but, it is worth it and also understandable for a game still in development. The game can still be played completely offline if no internet connection is available.

    And yes, more than half the gaming community is still without internet access whilst most games require permanent internet access for unnecessary reasons most of the time, why do you think things like piracy and server emulation is spiralling out of control? What will players without internet do? Just walk away and give up their favourite pastime? Not likely...

    Of course, large-scale multiplayer would (is going to) be awesome, if the new netcode allows for offline LAN multiplayer it would even be better, but please, in the name of all that is holy, do NOT strip away the offline functionality of the game (which is usually the case with MMOs).
     
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  15. Mix-martes86 Senior Engineer

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    SE becoming an MMO is the only one thing I can think of that would hinder the game's development, basically because it's a money sucker (specialized development and server maintenance). For me, changing the game's genre is not progress, but a totally unnecessary perversion that would bring countless problems. The current issues with bugs and feature-hype would look like childs play compared to what becoming an MMO would bring.
     
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  16. TehGM Apprentice Engineer

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    My Opinion is... MMO - no. KSH is too small to create a successfull MMO. I'm not saying they lack skills, cause honestly, they seem to be very skilled programmers - every week update means a lot, especially with such small team.
    It wouldn't work as an MMO, too. Technology (public part at least) didn't go that far yet. For MMO, it'd server as strong as Tranqillity (look: EVE Online's server, the most powerful gaming servers nowadays). Besides, there would be no way against grind - and for an MMO it'd be a huge problem.

    I'd love some big servers, yes. Like one or two giant servers. But besides that, it should stay as it is.
     
  17. noxLP Junior Engineer

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    I think we perfectly agree that as long as the "classical" way to play SE stills, there's no problem with an ADDed MMO to SE if it's technically possible, especially if it comes by the community as with the gates within servers.

    I think too that the main problem you (and others, of course) are facing when you say SE MMO, is what i've said in my last post: almost all MMOs out there are only MMO, no SP and no other type of MP.
    That's what people understand when you say MMO, and we both agree too that would be a bad idea. That's why that idea is usually not well recieved.
     
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  18. TehGM Apprentice Engineer

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    Read up on how MMO development goes. It HAS to be planned to be MMO before development. Otherwise it's just too much work to convert it.
    Also, about MMO dev too: when you build an MMO, you don't do add anything other. It's just too much work and time. Also a lot of mess in code. You just design it as an MMO.
    Telling you this as a game dev. Still just a hobbyist, but with some in-view on game development.
     
  19. noxLP Junior Engineer

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    I can imagine it, but well, it seems that with the gates there's a possibility of making something near a MMO withouth an extreme change in the development course or core of the game.
     
  20. TehGM Apprentice Engineer

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    That might just seem like it for end-user.
    While it is possible, and was brought up many times before infinite worlds, it'd still require a lot of work. Server would need to track each instances, and all entities. It'd be easier to have just one world, even.
     
  21. Ash87 Senior Engineer

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    Yeah... if only we believe, then all those technical blockers that would make this game a total mess as a MMO, would just go away!

    Lets all group up and sing Kumbaya everyone!
     
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  22. Kephyr Apprentice Engineer

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    They did go away with planets. I'm not saying that they are possible right now, but it's something worth working towards. Also, let's stay respectful, there's no need to be a snob.
     
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  23. BlackUmbrellas Senior Engineer

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    It really isn't.

    Becoming an MMO wouldn't add anything to Space Engineers; it'd be detrimental, even.
     
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  24. DDP-158 Master Engineer

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    Asking for everything and trying to appease all is also detrimental. Fallen earth.
     
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  25. cedi Apprentice Engineer

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    There are atm tons of ways to either grief other players or slow down the server. Keen would have to fix these issues if they wanted to turn SE into a MMO, which would result in limits for pretty much everything. Want to add a fifth drill to your ship? Denied. Want to create your eleventh ship? Denied. Want to create a giant, thousands of blocks large station for your faction? Denied. Want to turn that planet into swiss cheese? Denied.
    Because everything you want to do, the other 49999 players also want to do.

    (And I don't think Keen has any intention to spring the money for a petabyte of memory just so they can store all the planets and asteroids that someone partially mined.)
     
  26. a2457 Senior Engineer

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    interestingly most people assume SE becoming an MMo would be equal to SE not having singleplayer anymore.
    and i have no clue why.
    SE can keep its single player and creative modes, the multiplayer hosted by players,
    and just as well have an MMO server where people who wish to play it as an mmo , can join. if they wish so.
    and not if they prefer to not.
     
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  27. SirLANsalot Apprentice Engineer

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    There is this game out there....its called EvE Online, it would like to have a word with you.
     
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  28. BlackUmbrellas Senior Engineer

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    Here's the thing: MMOs require very different balancing. Making the game into an MMO would mean impacts on singleplayer, one way or another.
     
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  29. DDP-158 Master Engineer

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    Eve online isn't exactly carebears land. Even if you log off your station is still up for attacks, as well as any of the big ships. I used to dec high sec corps just to keep them from playing for a week. Imagine this game where your ship does t magically warp off
     
  30. BlackUmbrellas Senior Engineer

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    Pretty sure that was what they were referencing; the post they quoted mentioned that MMOs protect you when you're offline.
     
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