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Where is my Dedicated Server Bottle Neck?

Discussion in 'Groups & Dedicated Servers' started by SeaBiscuit, Feb 6, 2018.

Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.
  1. SeaBiscuit

    SeaBiscuit Trainee Engineer

    I have rented a dedicated server from an "approved" provider and I am seeing constant LAG throughout all players experience on the server.

    Before I get a response about... we can't help you until you post more info on <Insert Anything Here>... Please hear me out.

    I am a 20+ year Server/Desktop hardware expert. So I understand how bus speeds, Disk IO and other seemly overlooked areas plague application experiences.

    So, as a good tech, I am not looking for you to fully examine my system, configs etc right off the bat... I am really looking for some form of guide or help on bench marking my SE dedicated server as users are playing. As in... is there anything in real time which I can see. XYZ is killing Disk I/O... or XYZ is currently waiting on CPU Cycles?
    at this point, because of the Server HOST wanting to protect their OS (most likely on a shared server) I have no access to OS Level performance monitoring.

    some quick notes on my server to show I have a little bit of an idea about SE and I have done some research...
    The SE Dedicated server currently has no MODs installed. It has been running for about a month, with me reading every tweak, SE Config setting and making adjustments as I felt might help. I have turned off dogs (left spiders on for the current), Turned off Oxygen containment, and felt I have almost turned off most everything or limited it to the point I almost think it is too limited.

    **I originally played SE on my gaming system and hosted 7 friends... only issues we had was during SAVES (as others have reported, due to the large files hitting the disks). This system is a High-end i7 with 32gb RAM and 4 SSDs in RAID 10 conf. This initial experience was great other than I didn't want to always leave my system up. So I reached out to <REMOVED FOR NOW>, One of the preferred game server hosts. Package I purchased was a 20 Slot SE Server. First two weeks the game was unplayable. I spent them working with the HOST and adjusting every config setting I could read about on the web... the game now seems to be somewhat playable 1/2 of the time.

    Main Slowness is:
    * When someone Joins (10-30 seconds of horrible lags and rubberbanding)
    * Constant LAG - appears to be solved After a SE Dedicated Server APP restart (normally shows up after about an hour or so of SE Dedicated App uptime)
    * SAVE...

    Again, I only posted the symptoms to help you guess at the areas I need to try to monitor (or ask the host to monitor), like RAM Usage or Speeds etc. So far I will tell you I am pretty disappointed in hosting service, but before I go that route I want to make sure I am not missing something... Why I think it might be something on the config side is... most players I have had at one time seem to be 11, if the server is speced out for 20 players then 11 should be running pretty good. **The Server was unplayable when I had 3 users on it... and brand new with only those players grids, machines etc.

    Thanks in advance for your time and help.

    - Sea
  2. mdram

    mdram Apprentice Engineer

    virtual server? dedicated core? whole machine?
    what exactly are the specs of your server that you are allowed to use?
  3. SeaBiscuit

    SeaBiscuit Trainee Engineer

    Thanks for the reply...

    That is the mystery... if I was a betting man, I would say VM due to the fast scripting that built the server... (fill out online form, pay and 10 mins later you have a running SE server @2am)... anyway...

    **I am very aware of over allocated VM Environments and how someone could install 10 - "4 core" processor VMs on a server which only really has 8 physical cores. The smoke and mirrors that is VM is great for somethings... but troubleshooting performance issues inside a vm environment can be almost impossible to identify root cause without access to the VM Admin console and/or the underlying OS... and as far as I know... my host may be renting VMs from another host... that host may be over allocated... ?!?!?

    I have talked to my Server Host techs 6 to 8 times over the last month... via emails/tickets... all performance related... and they do not seem forthcoming on sharing their specs but I have not pressed them up to this point...
    I would have really thought, on a game that is several years+ old, they would have figured out what is needed from their equipment to handle ### Players. Clearly not the case...

    I will most likely just try swapping hosts but I wanted to at least give some basic troubleshooting a try first...

    If no one is aware of anything I can really monitor or ask the host to monitor I will prob move to a dedicated server in a colo... but was hoping not to have to pay for rackspace etc...
  4. mdram

    mdram Apprentice Engineer

    well an easy way to tell is price
    a vm server is cheap, 10-20 a month maybe 30

    a dedicated is 100 or more a month

    care to share a link to your host?
  5. SeaBiscuit

    SeaBiscuit Trainee Engineer

    I am on the low end $30/month for 20 slots... but it is possible is it just a shared server with other games... not sure... but i do know it is not a dedicated server...

    **at this point I have not been super nice about the host in this thread so I'm gonna hold off from putting their name in here... if I knew for a fact their hardware allowcation or whatever was the issue I would not mind sharing that to help others... but at this point i'm gonna hold off...

    I will say... they are found on this page: https://www.spaceengineersgame.com/official-dedicated-servers-hosts.html


    - Sea
  6. mdram

    mdram Apprentice Engineer

    for that price its def not a full machine

    maybe a core and some ram.
    that would be the performance hit
  7. Brain75

    Brain75 Trainee Engineer

    some things to advise right off the bat without knowing more about your config.
    Processor wise SE really does not go wide, it goes deep... so you need a single core as fast as you can rather than a N core wide at modest speed.
    Disk is horribly horribly un-optimized... as you saw before going DS, saves made a major lag spike - I wouldn't even consider any server unless the save was being made to a SSD.

    Some other random thoughts...
    Ports - all the ports open (SE takes the steam default and then some beyond that - have to hunt for the list of ports)... if you don't have them all it tries, tries, tries, then gives up and routes you through indirect connection via steam (and you get a "no direct connection" warning) - that retry while it is going through the ports seems to be freeze nightmare for the rest of the players.
    Some of these hosts are great, some... not at all, they put your counterstrike right next to your battlefield right next to your space engineers - they are just selling whatever and have no idea how to optimize for any game, they just sell.

    number of slots ... sooo many hosts brag about slots and you can buy 8 slots for this, 12 slots for this, 20 slots for only $30 a month, etc.... the game really honestly can not handle more than 12 without it grinding down to unplayable... save yourself some money if you bought a per slot and go down to 12 or so.

    Location - being close to the server seems to be more relevant than it should be.... Live in Austin, don't rent a host out of Chicago, go with one in Houston....

    If you are playing plain old vanilla there are a ton of servers out there... Play on some other dedicated servers around you, find one that is really perky introduce yourself to the admin, ask what host they are using.

    This last patch has introduced a ton of issues for everyone, even on vanilla... as of 186 you have to consider all your old troubleshooting as probably irrelevant to the current problem.
    • Like Like x 1
  8. SeaBiscuit

    SeaBiscuit Trainee Engineer

    Great Stuff Brain... Thanks...
    I think I may just build a top end game system (minus the video card) and throw and throw it in a colo... just wasn't looking to drop $1200+ on hardware and then have to pay $200 a month to put it somewhere so me and my friends could play SE...

    but then when the next game hits I will have a place to host it as well...
    thanks for all the advice happy building!

    - Sea
  9. Ronin1973

    Ronin1973 Master Engineer

    Let me expand on what Brain said... HEY DUDE!

    SE is a hungry beast. The "primary loop" is going to eat up an entire core. Some functionality has been parted out to other cores if they are available.

    The vast majority of commercial game servers are virtualized servers, with several virtualized servers running on one machine. You're sharing resources. This is fine and dandy if you're running a first person shooter server.

    However, SE is a hungry beast. Commercial game servers are usually single cores that give you no feedback as to what speed they are running at. Most will not give you an accounting of memory either.

    IMHO, you're wasting your time with commercial game servers. They'll take your money. Your server will run fine for the first day or two. But that helpless little virtual core will bog down... especially during game saves.

    You're better off just getting a second PC and hosting your server out of your own home. SE doesn't require a static IP address for people to find your server. If you're on a cable modem, then throughput won't be an issue. You just have to have the right ports open and your config files set correctly. There are tutorials on Youtube on how to set this up. Most of the information is still relevant even if the video is a few years old.

    By building your own box or just buying an older i5 or i7 machine, you'll spend less than what you'll pay in renting a true dedicated server each month. You'll also have a better machine than that server since server speeds are generally slower than consumer boxes. You can also overclock your machine, max out the memory, and use an SSD for your game saves.

    It's the only real way to get the performance you need if you have a busy server with lots of activity.
  10. Silentfighter89

    Silentfighter89 Trainee Engineer

    The only problem you have with a home server is bandwidth of your network. Some of us might be lucky enough to have some very good connections with the right internet provider and the right contract for decent down- and upload-speeds. where upload is mostly the bottle neck with standard treaty's.

    And then there is the problem with the not-fixed IP address (not the end of the world when you only want to play with some friends but a game breaker if you want more.

    You can get that from your internet provider (if you are close to a fiber connection). But it will cost you more on your internet contract, a lot more.
  11. R-TEAM

    R-TEAM Junior Engineer

    Have my server on my home workstation (a real workstation - 12 core xeon - many RAM and more than enough I/O ..) with an internet connection of 200mbit/s down - and 10mbit/s up speed , unlimited volumen -- for 29€ month
    The only problem is, naturaly, he is not 24/7 online ... but run very smoth - all player happy ...

  12. Diegor34

    Diegor34 Apprentice Engineer

    As R-Team spok, he has a 200 down and 10 up conection and run very smoth. Do you know the UP/Down speed of your server provider?

    I run my DS on an ESXI 6.0 server with a old (2x) Xeon E5620, I have allocated 8 cores and 16gb of ram for it, the cores in the end do not make much difference, we all know this, my only problem is my connection which is horrible, otherwise, the server runs nice with activated oxygen, mods and everything else, so I asked about the connection of your DS provider because the problem could be in there.
Thread Status:
This last post in this thread was made more than 31 days old.